Sex is important, so we need the space to talk about it…
Torrian L Baskerville (Director of HIV and Health Equity, Human Rights Campaign joins Karl Schmid on #PlusTalk
TORRIAN
It starts first with acknowledging and accepting who you are as a person.
KARL
Hello there. Welcome to plus talk on plus Life. We’re all about turning HIV positive into a plus. And speaking of plus and positive, we’re talking sex positivity today. And joining me is Torrian Baskerville. Hey, Torrin. Good to see you.
TORRIAN
Hey, Karl, how are you? Thanks for having
KARL
Me. I’m well, thank you. Sex positivity, what is that? What does it mean?
TORRIAN
Oh, sex positivity is the space to enjoy sex however you like, but not just enjoy it, but also talk about it, talk about it freely, talk about it without shame, without stigma, and just removing all of the isms that come from sex conversations.
KARL
So why is it important to talk about sex positivity when directly related to HIV?
TORRIAN
Very good question. So, you know, one of the main ways in which HIV is transmitted is through sex, right? And so if we’re going to have honest, real, transformative conversations around HIV and dealing with the epidemic, we have to have a conversation about sex. So if we are really talking about allowing people the space to learn about all the ways in which they enjoy sex or should right, maintain healthy during the ways in which they have sex, then that means we need to have the space to be honest about the ways in which we do it. If anyone feels like they’re going to be shamed for the way in which they have sex, they’re not gonna talk about it, right? It’s gonna be taboo, which we know is, has traditionally happened, particularly when we talk about the black and Latina communities.
KARL
So, how does someone become sex positive?
TORRIAN
When I started, I wasn’t always sex positive, right? It starts first with acknowledging and accepting who you are as a person, the ways in which you enjoy sex, and then just learning ways around how to talk about it, right? And understanding too that for many of us, sex is a natural behavior, right? It’s just something that we naturally desire or want to explore, right? And so instead of shaming folks or telling people, don’t do that, it’s important that we create the space to do that. So the best way, and the way I approach it, is just not telling people what to do, but giving them all of the information possible so that they can make the best decisions for themselves at the moment that they have to make that decision.
KARL
I think for a lot of us who receive an HIV diagnosis in the initial stages, that’s it. Sex is done, I’m never having it again. And then we lead to all that self-stigma, as well as the outside stigma that, you know, I’ve done something wrong. Why is it important for somebody living with HIV to at least try and explore and find that sex positivity within them
TORRIAN
For me, regardless of your status, right? A lot of the, the work that I, I, I lean in with is from a, a status neutral approach, right? That regardless of what your status is, we all want to be healthy, right? And when we talk about sex positivity, the the way in which we reframe sex is talking about how to be healthy, not safe, right? Because safe means that in somehow, I’m inherently danger in danger of something, right? But rather say, how do I maintain healthiness? And so if I’m living with HIV, what does healthiness looks like with now this diagnosis, right? If I’m not living with HIV, what does healthiness looks like to maintain my sero negativity, right? And so that’s the way in which I frame it. And so for a person with HIV, it’s important that you rediscover what life is now like with living with HIV. And so that, that, a component of that is thinking about what does sex now look like for me? Right? What does disclosure look like for me? What does my partner pool look like? Right? And so you have to think about all of those things. And so I always want to empower everyone, particularly those who are living with HIV, to go ahead and rediscover yourself, right? Think about what are the things that you like, how do you like it? Which ways you like it, where you like it done at, right? All of those things, because then that creates the atmosphere in the, in the space for you to really explore and grow and also continue to prioritize your healthiness.
KARL
It’s incumbent on me to disclose my status to every sexual partner. It’s, I have To and in, and certainly we can get into all the reasons why in this country people feel they have to.
Yeah. Criminality is one of them, sadly, right? But for, for someone who’s diagnosed and is, is living with HIV, how important is it to try and work through that, to find that moment where you can embrace who you really are and get out there and live life?
TORRIAN
I always implore folks living with HIV to disclose when you feel ready, when you feel that it’s a safe space to do so. Right? Because doing so when it’s not, that could mean harm, right? We, again, we have conversations and you know, around HIV criminalization, you spoke to it Carl, right? The reality is that many people, if you are disclosing to the wrong person, can alter your life dramatically, right? And so safety is important, but I, I think that it’s always important for folks living with HIV to take the time that is necessary for you to rediscover who you are except where you are, except your new diagnosis. Except what the new life is going to look like for you as a person living with HIV. I can tell you that when I was diagnosed, I was afraid. But, you know, I learned that my freedom and my liberation happened when I had to rediscover who I was, right? I had to live out to who I was fully, and that didn’t change from who I was prior to my diagnosis, right? I just had to navigate differently to then reimagine what with this diagnosis life looked like.
KARL
And how empowering is it for you then as a person living with HIV to discover that sex positivity within you and reclaim that because as, as I said at the top of the interview, so many of us think that’s it. Doors closed, and I’m no, I’m, I I I used to say damaged goods. I’m damaged goods. You don’t, and the only other people who want me are other people who are quote unquote damaged goods. How liberating was it for you to find that positivity within you and to be able to embrace sex and enjoy it in whatever form it takes for you?
TORRIAN
So it’s interesting because I think many folks, particularly gay men, right? Oftentimes, we, we, we think that AHIV diagnosis is just going to be a thing that’s going to happen in our lives, right? Many of us, like, oh, it comes with the territory of being a gay man, right? And so, throwing,
KARL
Throwing, being a black or brown gay man too, right?
TORRIAN
And right, and throw that in, right? And so, especially when you have stats like one and two, right? And so it, it was what helped me do that is like, okay, the worst has happened, right? Like, the worst part of what I could have ever had happen as a gay man has happened now. So now what does that mean that I stop living my life? Do I stop enjoying the things that I enjoy? Or does that mean I embrace who I am? I embrace this, and now I operate the world as such and change and move and shake the way in which I want to free and liberate it. And so that was the decision that I made. I wanna also be clear about this too, that it’s may sound easy, but it’s not. Right? You know, we’re talking about years of therapy. We talking about years of rediscovery. We’re talking years of sitting with self and, and, and figuring out what I wanted, what my life was gonna be like, who was I going to tell who I, who was I not going to tell? Why was I not going to tell them? And just live into that and understanding that it is what it is, but just growing to be my best, most authentic self. And that desire to do those things is what allowed me the space to really accept my diagnosis and live out that as fully as I possibly can.
KARL
And I would think that all the work you do with the human rights campaign too, just further amplifies that messaging, not just for yourself, but for your community.
TORRIAN
It wasn’t easy, right? I serial converted while doing the work, right? My diagnosis was not the catalyst for my doing HIV work, right? And so it was a struggle when I was first diagnosed, I was like, well, okay, God, I’m ready to be outta this work. Honestly, at that point, I was like, I’m exhausted with this work. I want to get out of the field. And then boom, my diagnosis happened and it was like, eh, maybe not so fast, right? Because what I understood was that if me, the person with all of the access, with all of the knowledge so much that I was teaching other folks this, if I was still able to see or convert, then what does that mean? Then it may not mean education, right? There must mean something else is at play, right? And so that’s really how I now look at the work now, right? It’s like, yeah, we can talk about the individual and how to empower the individual and get the individual, all of the, the education and access that is needed. But the reality is that there’s other layers to this conversation that, that, you know, needs to be addressed. So we’re talking about racism, homophobia, transphobia, right? Patriarchy, all of these things. Classism. We’re talking about a healthcare system that doesn’t always lend to the healthiness of black and Latina folks, right? So we’re talking about all of that. We’re talking about, you know, access, right? And so there’s a lot of things at play. I say all the time that medicine and science will take care of the science of HIV. It is our jobs as advocates to work and handle the people of HIV.
KARL
Well, I am grateful for all that work you do and for your positivity, not just on the sex side of things, but just in general. You’re a great person to chat to. Thank you Torrin, for your time today and, and for, as I said, being as positive as you are.
TORRIAN
Thank you, Karl. I appreciate it.
KARL
That is gonna do it for this episode of Plus Doc. If you want more information, check out the website plus life media.com. Remember, you can follow us across social media platforms. We are at Plus Life Media from all of us. Until next time, go have some fun sex. We’ll see you later. Bye.